Hollowed-Out Economy

Jobless Rate

Treasury Secretary Paulson, meeting with the G-7 Finance Ministers in Washington, tried to reassure them that the U.S. economic slump was only temporary.

He said he told his counterparts that checks from the stimulus package would go out in May and June and that they would add 500,000 to 600,000 jobs to the economy. He said that the federal government was helping more than a million homeowners keep their homes.

I worry that Paulson is engaging in reckless speculation about the future of the American job market. That somehow a flood of $600 checks next month from the government is going to lead to the creation of 600,000 new jobs is pure fantasy. That money is going to be used to pay down maxed out credit cards or keep cars from being repossessed. As Floyd Norris points out, the real jobless number (chart above) number for working-age men in America is not 4% but 13%. When someone gives up looking for work, the government no longer considers them unemployed–thus the huge discrepancy in the two figures.

What was even more curious about the G-7 meeting was the lack of outcry from our trading partners about the weak dollar.

There was no reference to any country’s intervening in the currency markets to stabilize the fluctuations, however, and no reference to whether the dollar’s recent slide against the euro had been too large, a trend that has worried many in Europe because it has made their exports more expensive and imports cheaper.

That’s because the Europeans and Asians are not worried about a flood of cheap American manufactured goods competing with their local producers. We have managed to so hollow-out our industrial plant in the last 30 years that they have little to fear. And as oil is priced in dollars, they have suffered far less in the recent price rises. With the dollar at an all time low against most major currencies, one would expect that the U.S. Trade deficit would shrink. But that’s not happening.

The gap between what Americans import and export unexpectedly widened in February as domestic demand rose for automobiles and fell back for crude oil. The trade deficit grew 5.7 percent, to $62.3 billion, its highest reading since November and the second consecutive month of increase.

Starting in the early 80’s the notion that the U.S. could become a service economy, dominated by the financial sector was promoted by everyone from Alan Greenspan to Jack Welch. Welch’s eagerness to move our greatest manufacturer, GE, into the financial services field, essentially commoditized half the firms revenue base. The disastrous results were revealed yesterday for all to see. Today, the financial sector makes up more than 20% of the S & P 500. Whereas the rise of the American economy since GE was founded by Edison in 1876, has been built on innovation, that differentiator is hard to apply in the financial services business. Beyond the credit card and the ATM, the innovations of late have been in the creation of $500 trillion of exotic derivative securities, so complex that regulators and rating agencies have no idea what they are looking at. And as any holder of the $43 trillion of Credit Default Swaps can tell you, these innovations can quickly turn into valueless commodities.

In March of 2005, Warren Buffet wrote some prophetic lines to his shareholders. He was trying to be dramatic, but it turns out his estimate of our future problems was mild compared to our present reality.

Mr Buffett said in the last 10 years foreign powers and their citizens had accrued about $3 trillion worth of US debt and assets such as equities and real estate. At current rates, he predicted that in another 10 years’ time the net ownership of the US by outsiders would amount to $11 trillion.

“This annual royalty paid [to] the world would undoubtedly produce significant political unrest in the US. Americans … would chafe at the idea of perpetually paying tribute to their creditors and owners abroad. A country that is now aspiring to an ‘ownership society’ will not find happiness in – and I’ll use hyperbole here for emphasis – a ‘sharecropper’s society’.”

The task of setting our country on a new course will have to be borne by both a new occupant of the White House and a new realization by the business leaders of our country that the dreams of an all service economy are as cruel to the future of their children as they are to the millions of jobless men throughout our country. Obama is not wrong that many of them are “bitter” and will look for scapegoats in the immigration debate. The fact that the Clinton’s have so harshly criticized him for stating the obvious shows how frozen our political climate has become. In the same way that GE’s Jeff Immelt must surely know that the future of his firm lies in making innovative manufactured goods for an energy efficient infrastructure, our whole economic and politcal conversation has to pivot towards a vision of rebuilding America’s hollow-out plant.


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0 Responses to Hollowed-Out Economy

  1. woid says:

    Excellent post, and winner of the Freudian Typo of the Day Award:

    “… regulators and ratting agencies…”

  2. Mike Scott says:

    I think you’ll find the jobless rate for working men is 0%, since if they’re working they have jobs. Perhaps you mean men of working age?

    But in any case, the percentage of non-working people in any age cohort is virtually meaningless without knowing how many of them actually want to work — many of them will be students, early retirers, etc. What you need is a statistic for the number of men of working age who want a job but don’t have one, regardless of whether or not they are claiming unemployment. In the UK, that would be the Labour Force Survey, but I don’t know if there’s an equivalent in the US.

  3. Em says:

    I don’t see it pointed out enough that the Fed can’t just keep printing money for the war without anyone noticing. Reality has to start hitting the economy, and now we can see it begin.

    There’s a weird upside, though, that some in the Federal Gubmint may try to point to in order to hide reality, though the countless unemployeed won’t be impressed. A lot of the biggest US companies are truly multinational, and you can see them moving quickly to shield themselves from US exposure. This means that the DOW and other indices can potentially do well even though the bottom may drop out in the US.

  4. vox populii says:

    As an American who is part of the ‘professional and educated’ work force, I have been watching with a growing dread the worsening economic situation. As more and more news of the situation comes across the wire, I’m reminded of living in Florida and waiting for the latest hurrican to sweep in and possibly destroy what scant possessions I had been able to amass. When you’re in that situation, you know days before the storm hits. For a week you live in anxiety of what might happen, watching the newest weather reports and analyzing the latest projected path.

    The effect of listening to the behavior of people in power and our spokesman to the world is similiar. This issue seems so big, that there is nothing that we can do about it and just have to brace ourselves for the storm. But we must remember that economies and markets are not natural forces. They are phenomena that arise from the industry of human beings. And so, we, as human beings, can do something about it.

    It’s easy to become cynical in these media soaked times where it is quiet obvious to anyone who is paying attention that the common good is far from the minds of the people who are steering this ship of state. I know that neither the company that I work for nor the government that represents me would think twice about my well being and are capable of making my life very difficult if it serves their self-interest. To them, I am a tax payer, a source of revenue, someone to keep docile and in-line with an easy option of disposal when I become inconvenient. But I have not lost hope in the inheriant capacity of human biengs to know compassion, empathy, and valor.

    What does this have to do with the current economic situation? It seems to me that our only hope in building a better future in America is to rebuild this ‘hollow economy’ from the inside out. The government and the 10% of the population who control 90% of the wealth have either no incentive or inclination to better the common plight. In the city where I live, I see hundred of new proposals for luxury accomidations. Everyday, construction is being carried out on some new ivory tower for the financial elite while affordable housing or affordable services are ignored. I often ask myself who is going to by a unit in one of these urban pleasure gardens? I often wonder who owns the city, the thousands of people who work there and make it a thriving center for industry, art, and culture; or some minority class of citzen that is quickly ascending into a state of financial godhood? We, the median and supporting lower orders, have been abandonned. The only question left is: what are we going to do about it?

    That hurricane in Florida hit and moved on, leaving my family with no damage. The apartment complex that we lived in had branches down everywhere and the poor maintenance staff was over worked trying to repair windows and clean up the grounds. Since I was unemployeed at the time, I offered to help. I was suprised that more people who called this warren of apartements their home didn’t do the same. When I was cleaning brush and putting it into piles, our neighbors thought that I was part of the grounds crew and were mildly shocked when I said that I wasn’t. This attitude of, “it’s someone else’s problem,” needs to be changed. America needs to become a community again with an investment in their neighbors succeeding. The last eight years has accumulated a pretty big pile of trash. We are all going to have to hike up our sleeves as neighbors in order to make it right.

    When children tear up an ants nest, the ants don’t start pointing fingers at each other and argue about who is going to rebuild.

  5. Brian says:

    So why aren’t you running for President?

  6. Matthew Lock says:

    “Whereas the rise of the American economy since GE was founded by Edison in 1876, has been built on innovation, that differentiator is hard to apply in the financial services business”

    There’s plenty of innovation in the American economy. Almost the entire computer/IT/web industry is American. Don’t forget aviation (Boeing etc), pharmaceuticals, biotech etc.

  7. Jon Taplin says:

    Matthew- The point I was making was that innovation in the financial sector is hard

  8. rc says:


    Knock yourself out. Here is the bureau of labor statistics site with the figures you requested:


  9. Jon Taplin says:

    Vox-Beautifully stated.

    My only hope is that tools of collaboration (blogs, social networks, etc) can somehow be harnessed to create communities of practice in rebuilding the anthill. I mentioned Kiva.com earlier in the week. There must be hundreds of similar “social entrepreneurs” out therewilling to work for the common good.

    John Kennedy gave a speech at Amherst College in 1963. He was talking about Robert Frost and the role of the artist.

    “The artist, however faithful to his personal vision of reality, becomes the last champion of the individual mind and sensibility against an intrusive society and an officious state. The great artist is thus a solitary figure. He has, as Frost said, a lover’s quarrel with the world. In pursuing his perceptions of reality, he must often sail against the currents of his time. This is not a popular role. If Robert Frost was much honored in his lifetime, it was because a good many preferred to ignore his darker truths. ”

    Maybe that’s our role–to have a lover’s quarrel with the world.

  10. Morgan Warstler says:

    “When I was cleaning brush and putting it into piles, our neighbors thought that I was part of the grounds crew and were mildly shocked when I said that I wasn’t. This attitude of, “it’s someone else’s problem,” needs to be changed. America needs to become a community again with an investment in their neighbors succeeding. The last eight years has accumulated a pretty big pile of trash. We are all going to have to hike up our sleeves as neighbors in order to make it right.”

    Government is the reason people know they aren’t required to help. You want more self-help, get rid of government. QED.

  11. Jason Dragon says:

    The government knows very well that we will be going more and more into debt as a nation. 11 Trillion may be a low number even. And the government is over 40 trillion in debt if you count all promised entitlements. So what is the solution to this. Well the solution, if I was in control, would be to print a ton of money and make the dollar almost worthless, so that your promices could be paid back with much less real assets. But you can’t do this and still get people to lend you money, so let’s tell everyone that there is little to no inflation.

    I think this is in fact what is happening, and those that notice it will be able to gain from it.

    – Jason Dragon

  12. PrettyCreatures says:

    “Government is the reason people know they aren’t required to help. You want more self-help, get rid of government. ”

    I don’t think so…I don’t think as many people have faith in the govt as you want to think. We’ve all seen how good (smirk) a job the govt has (not) done cleaning up after Katrina, how well they are cleaning as they go in Iraq (HA!). I think those people in their apartments want to be part of that rich minority. They want to think they’ve attained a status where they don’t need to get their hands dirty, they don’t need to worry about the messes in life and anyone who is cleaning up a mess is being paid by them to do so. Don’t bother me with the ugliness – “why should I waste my beautiful mind on something like that?” (Barbara Bush)

  13. Bill Spornitz says:

    Morgan said: ” Government is the reason people know they aren’t required to help. You want more self-help, get rid of government. QED.”

    I live in Manitoba; nominally run by a “Socialist” government (pro-business social democrats, really).

    We have harsh winters and short growing seasons. People who live here know the need to help each other out. But, the government has (and will always have) a major role in our success. Life here without the strong hand of a reasonable government would lead to huge problems.

    Every time some USA person advocates for “smaller government” I think about your two terms of “smaller government” GWB and the ruin that it has brought. The USA has a bad habit of worshiping wrong thinking and poor leadership; this has to stop.

  14. Morgan Warstler says:

    It’s pretty much a fact boys. Liberals give less to charity than conservatives, the only reason this makes sense, is because they feel like they already gave to the government – helping people is the governments job, not the liberals.

  15. RR Little says:

    Most of the liberals I know can’t afford to give to charities the way they’d like to; we represent the bottom 5th of the US economy. We do the best we can with what little time we have to try and make a difference, whether it is working in soup kitchens to removing garbage from local wild areas.
    Many conservatives give to charities out of the goodness of their hearts, I’ll grant you that. But that is a very broad brush you’re using there.

  16. Ken Ballweg says:


    Conservative giving to charity is totally distorted by large donations for tax shelter purposes. Don’t get to infected by the neo-con anti-liberal spin.

    Thanks to the predatory siphoning of our national wealth into corporations that function as nation states in all but geographical definition, we are headed towards a major depression that will redefine “liberal” and “conservative”. The Bushes have done all they can to undo the New Deal years, and done it so effectively, that the only hope for the working stiffs is to try to suffer through and survive until the pendulum swings enough to reinstate the next New Deal era. Our values have been so skewed by protracted propaganda that we forget that, by current practice, Conservative = predatory self interest and Liberal = concern for community; i.e. anything that blocks predatory self interest like taxes and regulation equals “liberal”.

  17. Jon Taplin says:

    Ken- You are right. Anyone making $10 million a year (like Bill Clinton) sets up a Family Foundation for tax purposes. Most of the really well off are Republicans.

  18. My $600 check will be used to keep making the monthly minimum payments on my credit-card debt.

    Awesome post, Jon.

    The problem of jobless men (and women) in America (and the world) is too big and complex for me to get my mind around.

    Less obvious, but a major contributor to our present indebtedness as Americans, is underemployment among men, especially older men.

    Most frightening for the short- and medium-term future is the amazing failure of our schools and colleges to educate and train the next generation of men.

    I hate to say it, but I think we Americans became accustomed to living way too high in a mostly poor world. I don’t think we will be able to return to our former affluence, and in consideration of social justice, we should not make that our goal.

    I think we should attempt to adjust our consumption to the realities of a world in which resources (food and fuel, particularly) will be scarce and costly.

    I think there is a worldwide over-supply of labor. I think it will be a struggle for us to compete and survive.

    The solution, for me at least, would be to learn to live more simply. Easier said than done. I am trying to figure out how to restructure my life so that I will be able to afford the essentials of food, shelter, transportation and health care. I do not expect to ever return to my former level of modest affluence. — Bernie

  19. La Hedonista says:

    I always find this an interesting read; it’s from across the pond:


  20. professormak says:

    Excellent documentary. Stating things as they are.The hollowed out economy will take some work to get back where it was. It will be quite some years before things are straight again.

  21. “Hollowed-out” is right. CEOs took our jobs overseas so they could boost their own take at our expense (oh, and get around environmental laws, too). Now we make nothing and will soon have nothing. It’s a classic Mafia-style “bust-out” done by “patriotic” conservatives.

    By the way, anyone who buys into the Grover Norquist “all goverment is evil” crap really needs to get educated. Start with the plot to destroy Social Security and parcel out the trust fund to the brokerage-firm industry: http://phoenixwoman.blogspot.com/2006/11/permanent-recession-or-permanent-boom.html

  22. Pingback: What I have been doing this morning « Stephen Rees’s blog

  23. American Acerbity says:

    Liberal = willing to spend my money on people who may not need it.

    Conservative = willing to spend my money on people who certainly don’t need it.

    Good post, all in all. The fact remains that the US is about 75% to the total destruction of itself through all the many and varied bits of soul it’s sold off to foreign countries. And don’t fool yourself, Obama isn’t going to do shiznit to make the economy any better and neither will Clinton or McCain. Too much big oil, big business, big insurance – whatever ‘big’ you like – invested too deeply and with too much control over what happens in the US. They can’t make a national insurance program truly work because big insurance doesn’t actually want to pay anything out. They can’t do what needs to be done to break the oil addiction because big oil would go bankrupt – oh, and don’t forget the economy would collapse too.

    Hello, if this country keeps on this heading – hell, even if it gets moved a few degrees to the liberal – the economy is STILL going to collapse. I’m not a fatalist, but I sure am a realist. And it’s past time America wake up and smell the refuse. If we, as the people, don’t take back control of this country, there may not be much country left into the next century and beyond. Will I be alive to see it? Probably not. Will my children or there children – most definitely so. And I’m not comfortable with that.

  24. grownANDsexy says:

    I agree with Mike Scott. Asking what men of working age that are not working isn’t as important as those who are looking for work but did not file for unemployment.

    I would like to include people who just stopped looking because they can not find anything, but that number is hard to get down. Is the person who gave up someone who would start working if something came up? Is this the person who refuses to be under-employed (I.E. refuses to become a security guard after being CFO of a small company), is this person in school but would stop school if they could get something?

    Oh and instead of just including ‘men of working age’ it may be smart to include women too. lol

    Also note: I do not have a problem of having foreign investors like so many do. I also do not have a problem of being a service country rather than manufacturing of farming… I have a problem with becoming a debt/credit driven country. That is the problem.

    We invest in other countries too to the tune of billions and trillions of dollars, right? Am I correct in this statement?

    Its all a balancing act, but the debt/credit part is way out of sync. The general population is saving on average 0 in savings???? What the hell kind of number is that? Families earning 100,000 a year have 5-10 thousand in the bank savings? Can’t live 6 months let alone a year if they were to loose their jobs off of savings?

    Good lawd… The only big debt anyone should have is school and housing… not credit cards.

  25. Morgan Warstler says:

    WRONG! Guys you are wrong. The facts say you are wrong. You need to alter your belief system’s accordingly.

    “People who identify themselves as conservatives donate money to charity more often than people who identify themselves as liberals. They donate more money and a higher percentage of their incomes.

    It is not that conservatives have more money. Liberal families average 6 percent higher incomes than conservative families.

    You may recall a flap during the 2000 election campaign when the fact came out that Al Gore donated a smaller percentage of his income to charity than the national average. That was perfectly consistent with his liberalism.

    So is the fact that most of the states that voted for John Kerry during the 2004 election donated a lower percentage of their incomes to charity than the states that voted for George W. Bush.

    Conservatives not only donate more money to charity than liberals do, conservatives volunteer more time as well. More conservatives than liberals also donate blood.

    According to Professor Brooks: “If liberals and moderates gave blood at the same rate as conservatives, the blood supply of the United States would jump about 45 percent.”

    Professor Brooks admits that the facts he uncovered were the opposite of what he expected to find — so much so that he went back and checked these facts again, to make sure there was no mistake.”


  26. grownANDsexy says:

    Oh and my 600 dollar check?
    I’m adding 1500 to it an buying a brand new computer to help me start up my business. I am guessing that this is what the stimulus is all about… but how many people are going to do this???

    By the way, for those who are just going to pay a bill or credit, paying down credit helps the banks so in a way, yeah that helps cause he banks sure do need it. lol

    As for the bills, like to cell companies for example, they need the money too. So maybe its a win-win for everybody. If you pay a bill (most likely a credit card) then the money is going into businesses for services rendered. I guess the only problem is if you pay down on your mortgage because that is where all the drama is happening at… and what happens next month when the mortgage payment is due?

  27. rhb says:

    Marylandonmymind what a mellifluous screen name. Your comment states feelings close to my own. Something in what you said evoked this New Deal thought. The schools are in trouble. Large numbers of job trained workers of all kinds are out of work, what about a job corp that involves the jobless with helping to reduce the work load at the schools while addressing the fact the education in this complicated world should be a life long project. I have more to say about this but I am going to go think about first.

  28. Jon Taplin says:

    rhb- Excellent idea, as usual. I think if the economy really goes south, it will take a massive infrastruture driven jobs program that is a public-private partnership.

    Morgan- My guess is that the numbers you cite about charitable deuctions is more about church going than political party. I can bet you church goers give a higher perccentage of their income to charity.

  29. garyb50 says:

    Morgan, you are a tool. But keep posting because you’re a useful tool.

    A Professor Brooks quote:

    “One way to reduce illegal immigration might be to translate some of our far left publications into Spanish and give everyone in Mexico subscriptions. After they read how terrible this country is, many may want to stay away.”

    Did I say tool? OOPS, sorry… I meant fool.

  30. Morgan Warstler says:

    Gary, I’m just right, which is the opposite of wrong. Someone here has to stop the circle jerk. I’m your cold shower as it were.

    The stats say clearly that liberals are stingy, regardless of church going or not. I have posited the reason for that proved stinginess is an over-reliance on government to solve problems. To me, it’s the same reason Kitty Genovese got raped in front of 38 people, everyone else thinks someone else will stop it.

    It is why I favor localization in all things, it increases social fabric, unfortunately government gets in the way of that.

    BTW, I loves me some open door immigration, so much so, I personally think we should broadcast English lessons all over the world.

  31. Jon Taplin says:

    Morgan- Don’t be so arrogant. Arthur Brooks research was paid for by the American Enterprise Institute. For him to say this is not what he was expecting is a joke. This is what we call a self-fulfilling prophecy.

    Heritage, AEI, Grver Norquist turn out these custom made research projects five times a year. Don’t be a sucker for their “manufactured consent”.

  32. Morgan Warstler says:


    “Republican States Give More Than Democrat States To Charity

    A study done by Catalogue for Philanthropy has found that people in Republicans states give more than people in Democrat states. The study is based on the percent of income people from each state give to charities. Mississippi was the top giver followed by Arkansas. The top ten states that gave the most donations are Republican red states while 9 out of the 10 least giving states are Democrat blue states.”

    “We call it the “Opportunity Index,” and the point it makes is simple: if donors in the IRS’ top income group (over $200,000) in the higher-income states would give according to their state ranks in income for their group, as Wyoming does (i.e., 1st in both)—e.g., Nevada 2nd, New York 3rd, Massachusetts 9th, etc.—total giving nationally, and quality of life especially in those states, would increase significantly. Depending on how that is calculated, in 2005 (the latest numbers available) charitable giving would have been higher by 20% or more.”


    Look, you are wrong. Please just say it. Conservatives / Republicans GIVE MORE. They are bigger better givers. Not rich folk… conservative folk.

    You don’t want to confront this fact head on, you want to squirrel around, because it indicates that the deep personal source of what makes people conservative is NOT greed. It indicates that liberals just talk, talk, talk a big game, but they don’t actually care about the poor, they just want to steal from the rich.

    Jon, just internalize the fact. Go fix your own side, scream at liberals from your perch, that they are hypocrites. Pluck the log from your own eye and all that.

  33. Snowrunner says:

    “Government is the reason people know they aren’t required to help. You want more self-help, get rid of government. QED.”

    The Government is BY the people FOR the people. If you take a “sit back and wait” approach or think that the Government is useless in the first place then you get the Government you deserve.

    This is where the talk of “small Government” screwes everybody over. What one needs is not a small Government but an EFFICENT Government, one that is owned by the people.

    The problem is that most people are so enamored with the idea that they live in a democracy that it never occurs them that democracy doesn’t run itself but requires input, time and control by its citizens.

  34. Morgan Warstler says:

    We actually prefer the term “Republic.”

    Government is BY and FOR the people, it is BY and FOR the polticians. That’s not rain coming down on your head.

  35. Deborah says:

    Thank you for trying to clarify those slippery employment stats that government loves to trot out during election cycles. However, there is also another important figure the Feds refuse to take into account: the American self-employed is a sector of the economy that has grown exponentially over the last twenty-five years. Self-employed workers have NEVER been accounted for in these figures because they do not qualify for unemployment and therefore are never reported as “unemployed.” In the last two decades, many industries have turned to the self-employed to fill once full-time positions because its more economically feasible for them to do so. By hiring the self-employed, companies don’t have to comply with health and safety standards, 8-hour work days, worker protection laws barring discrimination and harrassment, wage increases, vacation pay or health insurance. It is doubtful that full-time employment will be the defining characteristic of the American worker in the 21st century.

    Right now, my entire immediate family and extended family are self-employed workers living in California — perhaps the self-employed capital of the nation! I am watching how each and every one of my family is working harder and longer hours in worsening employment conditions to stay afloat. With soaring gas prices and cost of living expenses, their ability to economically survive this recession will become incresingly impossible. I am convinced that, whoever ends up in the Oval office, the only way to avoid a widespread economic Depression will be for the incoming administration to focus on annual income and NOT employment status as a marker. Frankly, I don’t care how well the presidential candidates sound on our deficit, the economy and the environment (what I believe to be THE three most important issues immediately facing the nation). I do care that they know the issues, particularly the landscape that defines American labor, and I will be scrutinizing their plans for keeping us from going into a full-on economic tailspin.

  36. Dan says:

    Can there ever be a thread that doesn’t involve Morgan declaring liberals to be stupid and greedy?

  37. Adron says:

    Another point, VERY important one, is that we need a dileneator between smaller Government. What do people mean by this? I think we need a MUCH smaller, fiscally responsible Federal Government, I however have very different opinions of State and City Governments. These are the “Governments” that actually do anything useful anyway. The feds are just a pain in the ass, the states are the ones busting their ass with the leftovers of the federal rape of the country trying to keep things together.

    But alas… the only one that really has control is the Feds…

  38. Morgan Warstler says:

    Dan. I just state the best facts I could find. Don’t be upset with me if the facts don’t mesh with your version of reality.

    My question to you is, if you KNEW for sure the facts as stated above were correct, wouldn’t that make you question the motives of your liberal groups? Would you ever under any circumstances wonder if perhaps “helping others” is just a load of crap used to get votes, not to actually help? Would you ever even wonder?

    Where is your introspection?

    If the facts said to me, hey less-government conservatives, are greedy rich people, I’d pay attention to the facts. But those aren’t the facts. now you like Obama, might want to write off the reasons people don’t believe in liberal dogma, why they “cling” to guns, and religion, et al. But frankly, you only write off what you are afraid to really consider: liberals are greedy and think everyone else is stupid.

  39. Jon Taplin says:

    Dan- I too would like Morgan to contribute some original work to this. He seems incapable of that.

    Adron- The only way to control the Federal Government is to change the tax system so that more money flows to the states and cities and less flows to Washington

  40. Peter says:


    With respect to your reference to the Catalogue of Philanthropy, I can find the second quoted paragraph, but not the first. Are you quoting a separate source? If so, could you provide the reference to the first quoted paragraph?

    Otherwise, there’s a bit of a disconnect between the source you cited and the way you framed the source in the first place.

  41. grownANDsexy says:


    All this arguing with morgan… but research does show that conservative do give more. Its been known for a while. You can easily Google it.

    I await someone who disagrees with him to post a link saying liberals give more or the same amount.

    And yes, self employment is what is most likely going to be the future. Some say the next step after knowledge workers is the self contained business… in other words you won’t just be a business man, you are the business, man!

    I am not sure how the self employed fit into the economic model of employment. Then again, just like many people focus on “the average”, maybe we should look at the other employment formulas that would be akin to looking at the “mode” and the “mean” numbers so we can see what really going on?

    What’s the point of just looking at “the average” rent of a NYer when the mode or the mean might tell you what most people really pay? Same with employment.

  42. Whether or not liberals give more or less charity than conservatives is irrelevant to the discussion itself of the rise in joblessness, the falling dollar, and the expanding trade deficit. I don’t think a person’s political alignment is going to matter for crap if this country spirals into a recession. Liberal? Conservative? Pointless. All that will matter are the Haves and the Have Nots.

    All that Mr. Warstler’s pointless drivel amounts to is a steaming pile of red herring. You’re only making him happier by arguing against his point instead of ignoring him.

  43. frank says:

    thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  44. Morgan Warstler says:

    Sorry other source:


    “Whether or not liberals give more or less charity than conservatives is irrelevant to the discussion itself of the rise in joblessness, the falling dollar, and the expanding trade deficit.”

    Of course it is relevant. It goes to MOTIVE & thus FOLLOW THROUGH, in light of their personal selfishness, why believe the motives of liberals is to help the less fortunate?

    Who is a better person:

    A person of who says “I have no political obligation to help the poor,” but then DOES SO for moral reasons.


    A person who says, “Everyone else must help the poor,” but then DOESN’T DO IT THEMSELVES.

    You folks shouldn’t get mad at me for pointing out big giant obvious facts. I’m not trying to pee in your Cheerios, I just find it all very curious.


    Warning: the next observation is based on ANOTHER FACT!

    And are your folks familiar with the % of the taxes, paid by the top 20% of Americans?

    I’m just asking. Because every year, they pay more and more of the bill. Do you realize that?

  45. rhb says:

    No Morgan, they control more and more of the capital, as in the rich getting richer, while complaining more and more about how damn unfair it all is that they have to pay any taxes at all. What a bunch of whiners. Wieners. Standing on the backs of everyman and wondering why the people who think and are smart enough to realize the inequity are trying to pull them down. After all, couldn’t anybody climb up here, they ask?

    But the rest of you are right, we are supporting poor Morgan with our co-dependancy tactics. We probably need to show him some tough love and ignore him for a long while.

  46. thats good article, best regards

  47. this is a great read thanks for posting this.

  48. berm says:

    Great works

    thats good article, best regards

  49. ilovecash says:

    Unfortunately, I don’t have much faith in any of the candidates for the Presidency setting our country on a “new course”. They’re mostly out for themselves, they don’t care much about us. Hillary Clinton lost my vote when I saw her on YouTube congratulating Walter Cronkite for his “globalism award” and saying that he was proud to be sitting at the “right hand of Satan”. Yup. She lost my vote right there. Not only that, but she wants me to be forced to have health care, even though I don’t want or need it right now. America isn’t a socialist country like her or Obama want it to be and it’s definitely not a fascist country like McCain wants it to be. Elect McCain and we’ll end up with a surveillance society with cameras watching your every move just like those 4 million CCTV cameras in London.

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